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FDP Forum / The Chop Shop / Do you ever have trouble playing with someone because of how they play?

Previous 20 Messages  
thumbpicker
Contributing Member
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St. Louis

"Thumbpicks don't slide into soundholes"
Feb 20th, 2019 09:03 AM   Edit   Profile  

Kind of funny the finger style thing was brought up. I’ve always played that way because I liked playing with a trio so you get used to covering quite a bit of the spectrum. A bit of the baseline a bit of rhythm and a few lead riffs now and then depending on the song.
I do a lot of solo acoustic stuff as well so I have gotten used to “covering” a lot of the background stuff to keep the song full sounding.
When a lead player is present I have to work on letting go of some stuff so there’s enough room for everyone.

Just different styles I guess. If you cover a lot instrumentally you have to leave a hole for the other guy.

Ryder
Contributing Member
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Northwest Missouri

Butterscotch Blues
Feb 20th, 2019 09:42 AM   Edit   Profile  

“If you cover a lot instrumentally you have to leave a hole for the other guy.“

thumb, I’m the other guy, and the hole is right, but I don’t get one. I totally understand if you’re doing a lot of solo acoustic stuff...which he does. When we’re playing together in church he doesn’t seem to know to leave the hole for me. That’s when the problem happens because when I’m supposed to do a lead...well you see where I’m coming from...

thumbpicker
Contributing Member
*******

St. Louis

"Thumbpicks don't slide into soundholes"
Feb 20th, 2019 10:15 AM   Edit   Profile  

It can be tuff at times depending on who you’re playing with.Worst case are the ones who are on autopilot with strumming. When it’s acoustic stuff we’re all about the same volume so instead of one guy turning up a bit for a solo everyone else needs to back down a bit because frankly you can try digging in single notes and you don’t really gain much volume.
If I played with someone regularly like that I’d just casually mention that I have a hard time judging my volume when he’s picking a lead part or a complicated finger style part. May make him think about his own parts more and where he sits in the mix. Or you can pick a lead part out at a lower volume and the rest will have trouble hearing and back down a bit. There’s no tried and true recipe I’ve found. It depends on the rest of the players ability to judge where they fit.

Ryder
Contributing Member
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Northwest Missouri

Butterscotch Blues
Feb 20th, 2019 11:39 AM   Edit   Profile  

It’s just a complicated situation.
Our volumes are handled by the sound guys who are volunteers and don’t know about pushing my slider up a bit when I do a lead part.
I’ve talked to my band leader (acoustic finger picker). He said they don’t understand and when he offers training, usually on a Saturday, none of them show up.
Isn’t that swell? I think they just like sitting back there in the middle where the sound and light boards are.
Very frustrating.

littleuch
Contributing Member
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Ocala, Florida

Blowing bubbles
Feb 20th, 2019 12:12 PM   Edit   Profile  

Aside from playing with someone who's skills far exceed or fall short of mine (been in both situations), not often but I think I know what you mean. It's been mostly an oddity with drummers I find confounding. I can think of two drummers I've played with, both are outstanding. They tick all of the boxes so I wouldn't fault either for anything. But given the opportunity to use either on a project I'd have a clear favorite. And it has nothing to do with personality (actually the other one would probably be my preference based on that criteria). Something about their playing style makes me more cautious with one and comfortable with the other.

I'm sure the "thing" can be identified, but I almost like the intangible aspects of musicianship.

Achase4u
Contributing Member
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U.S. - Virginia

Feb 20th, 2019 12:19 PM   Edit   Profile  

"It’s just a complicated situation.
Our volumes are handled by the sound guys who are volunteers and don’t know about pushing my slider up a bit when I do a lead part.
I’ve talked to my band leader (acoustic finger picker). He said they don’t understand and when he offers training, usually on a Saturday, none of them show up.
Isn’t that swell? I think they just like sitting back there in the middle where the sound and light boards are.
Very frustrating."

Argh. The fader ride is the OLDEST engineers tool in the book. It was actually the only one in the book if you go far back! What a shame.

Ryder
Contributing Member
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Northwest Missouri

Butterscotch Blues
Feb 20th, 2019 01:50 PM   Edit   Profile  

It is a shame!
He also told me, at one time, there was a guy who handled the sound. He would go to every band practice so he would know what to to look for in each song.

We sure don’t have anyone like that now.

reverendrob
FDP Data Goon
Moderator

She hath it all,

& hath no need of thee.
Feb 23rd, 2019 02:46 AM   Edit   Profile  

I'm a simple man.

If I'm not playing with people who make me unsure of who's doing what, and afraid to stop doing something, anything - because it'll fall apart - but utterly unsure it's me...I don't do it again.

But I also look for folks who are looking just as much as I am to explore and live in that moment.

Otherwise, I'll stay there myself and not let it be ruined.

Ryder
Contributing Member
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Northwest Missouri

Butterscotch Blues
Feb 23rd, 2019 09:36 AM   Edit   Profile  

Our church band would not fall apart obviously with me not being there. The leader is very experienced in doing solo gigs.

ninworks
Contributing Member
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Middle Tennessee

Too Much GAS
Feb 23rd, 2019 12:10 PM   Edit   Profile  

Perhaps, when he gets too busy with the accompaniment you could simplify what you are playing. Longer-sustained-note stuff.

I find that simple double-stop stuff works sometimes when single note things get cluttered.

If what he is playing sounds okay while he's singing the melody try playing that or something similar.

There's probably a work-around to make it all sound good. You just have to find it.



Ryder
Contributing Member
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Northwest Missouri

Butterscotch Blues
Feb 23rd, 2019 12:24 PM   Edit   Profile  

ninworks, actually that’s kind of what I do. I try not to play in the position(s) he’s playing in.
Or I try to weave myself in and around what he’s doing.
I’m thinking about what all of you have said, and once my foot heals enough to go back. I’ve got plenty to try out.

I guess my main problem is, and probably MY problem...is when playing a distinct solo is how he plays rhythm. And as mentioned, the sound guys do t know when to turn me up.
A while back, before the sound guys got there I asked him to set my level because I wanted to use less gain. What I should have done was also turn the volume on my guitar down. That way I have a little more volume when I need it. I’ll have to do that when I go back.

Thanks to you and the rest who have commented. I really appreciate it.

greg1948
Contributing Member
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Vero Beach FL

Tbird Greg
Apr 2nd, 2019 06:33 AM   Edit   Profile  

"It doesn’t often happen when I’m playing the bass, I think guitar players are used to riding on the bass line as reference, it’s easier to keep them reined in. When they do go off or the lead gets a bit out of control they know where I am, I’ll keep it simple so they can figure it out, and they can adjust the line to fall back into place."

Says it all for me as a guitar player. I need that bass line to fall back on when I get a bit out of control.


walshb
Contributing Member
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Manchester, TN

Ask me how I know!?
Apr 7th, 2019 05:59 AM   Edit   Profile  

What irks me the most about playing with others, or even watching a band, is a rhythm guitar player who doesn't know when to turn down during a guitar solo. And I see that way too often. Usually, the band really suffers because of this. No dynamics whatsoever. Your leader may not be aware of this phenomenon...?

"Our bass player is excellent. He’s been in the band since the beginning and also plays in a couple of other bands. Maybe I’ll just listen to him."

I always cue off the bass at church. If the bass player makes a mistake, I'll usually be right there with him, unless it's a song I really know well and have played a lot of times. In that case, I hope that he's hearing what I'm doing. ;)
I have the acoustic guitar up loud enough to hear it in my mix, and the other electric guitar, if there is one, down in my mix.

Ryder
Contributing Member
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Northwest Missouri

Butterscotch Blues
Apr 8th, 2019 05:57 AM   Edit   Profile  

walshb, I don’t think he is aware. And our bass player hasn’t been to practice in the 8 years I’ve been playing with them. He times it so he arrives in time to plug in, tune up and play.

If we have changed something either the band leader or I will fill him in.



walshb
Contributing Member
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Manchester, TN

Ask me how I know!?
Apr 8th, 2019 07:16 AM   Edit   Profile  

Hmmm, that sounds like our bass player. And our drummer, also!
I'm usually ready anywhere from 10 to 15 minutes before the scheduled practice time. In fact, I'm always the second person there, behind the praise team leader.

Ryder
Contributing Member
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Northwest Missouri

Butterscotch Blues
Apr 8th, 2019 08:46 AM   Edit   Profile  

Same here. Always the second one there after the leader. At practice same thing. I put the music on everyone’s stand.

When I got back after my foot surgery everyone said it’s about time, we had to get our own music! ;-)

hushnel
Contributing Member
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North Florida

A Friend of Bill W.
Apr 8th, 2019 10:39 AM   Edit   Profile  

I’m a rehearsal Nazi, I’d rather have some one call it off than show up and want to jam all evening rather than getting right to the set list. Usually a guitar payer, though not always.

I will encourage some loose jam or noodling with some of the guitar payers ideas, stuff he wants to try on some tune, warming up, whatever, for a half hour or so. Now and then we get together informally to just play and fool around. Or dedicate a rehearsal to working in new material, I just like to see the work getting done.

I know ya gotta make space for improvisation, trying different stuff, vocals etc. It needs to be fun. If I had a recording of all our sets I’d be running through them every couple of days.

Like Greg said above, it’’s not uncommon for members to rely on the bass to know were he’s at, particularly in a group that doesn’t use a drummer..

Achase4u
Contributing Member
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U.S. - Virginia

Apr 8th, 2019 11:42 AM   Edit   Profile  

All the time. Mostly because they are way better than me :-)

Doc Sarvis
Contributing Member
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USA/Salt Lake City

Tuned Strings and Tight Lines
Apr 9th, 2019 05:35 PM   Edit   Profile  

Yes.

I play with myself all the time and it's completely frustrating. ;-)



walshb
Contributing Member
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Manchester, TN

Ask me how I know!?
Apr 11th, 2019 07:02 PM   Edit   Profile  

Lol!


Previous 20 Messages  

FDP Forum / The Chop Shop / Do you ever have trouble playing with someone because of how they play?




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