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FDP Forum / Moe's Tavern (_8^(I) / Another Amtrak Accident!

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ECS-3
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USA / Virginia

Feb 4th, 2018 09:02 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

One thing to keep in mind is that AMTRAK owns / operates very little physical track, they run on host RR tracks.

So, if that is CSX track, then CSX might be part of the problem. Have to wait (years?) to find out who was asleep at the switch.

ECS-3
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USA / Virginia

Feb 4th, 2018 09:15 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Yea, so I looked this up in the back of the AMTRAK timetables.

AMTRAK Train 91 is a New York to Miami train that runs daily, so it's a regular train that runs every day.

The section from Raleigh, NC to DeLand, FL is CSX track. So the traffic cop would be CSX.

(This message was last edited by ECS-3 at 11:17 AM, Feb 4th, 2018)

Leftee
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VA

Life makes a man tired.
Feb 4th, 2018 02:07 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

It looks like the Amtrak train ran in to a parked CSX train.

So incredibly sad.

6L6
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San Francisco, CA

Feb 4th, 2018 02:31 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

With all the safety controls being utilized I just don't see how this could happen.

Leftee
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VA

Life makes a man tired.
Feb 4th, 2018 02:50 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Repeatedly!

There's been articles on the lax safety culture at Amtrak. But when does anything change?

K4
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Being defenseless

does not make you more safe
Feb 4th, 2018 03:19 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Not to derail this, but a government bureaucracy runs Amtrak

HeavyDuty
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Northeast IL

Not very bright but does lack ambition
Feb 4th, 2018 03:35 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

It’s a public corporation run by professional railroaders. Big difference.

Leftee
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VA

Life makes a man tired.
Feb 4th, 2018 03:38 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

We’ve been doing “train” in this country longer than any other more of land transportation.

HeavyDuty
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Northeast IL

Not very bright but does lack ambition
Feb 4th, 2018 03:42 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Reports are coming in that the current signal system was cut out to allow PTC installation work, and that trains were operating under track warrant authority (a manual dispatch and deconflict process.)

I'm going to predict that someone screwed up and left a switch open, either the CSX freight crew or (if the switch was remotely operated) the dispatcher. That this was an Amtrak train will end up having no bearing on the accident, it could have just as easily been another freight.

Leftee
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VA

Life makes a man tired.
Feb 4th, 2018 03:44 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I saw that news too. It easily could have been a CSX train.

Dang autocorrect!

(This message was last edited by Leftee at 09:43 AM, Feb 5th, 2018)

K4
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Being defenseless

does not make you more safe
Feb 4th, 2018 03:58 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

" The National Railroad Passenger Corporation (Amtrak) is a government-owned corporation established in 1971 to provide intercity passenger train service throughout the United States. The name Amtrak comes from a combination of “American” and “track.” "

External link

HeavyDuty
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Northeast IL

Not very bright but does lack ambition
Feb 4th, 2018 04:06 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

“government-owned corporation”

HeavyDuty
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Northeast IL

Not very bright but does lack ambition
Feb 4th, 2018 04:06 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

double tap

(This message was last edited by HeavyDuty at 06:07 PM, Feb 4th, 2018)

ECS-3
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USA / Virginia

Feb 5th, 2018 06:59 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Again, keep in mind that CSX runs the switches and signals. AMTRAK doesn't own much, if any actual right of way / track. The tracks they run on are listed in the back of the AMTRAK timetables.

jhawkr
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Wichita, KS USA

It's all gravy from here on...
Feb 5th, 2018 07:31 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Economy is doing well, freight traffic is up. More and longer trains keeping the rails busy. Add in antiquated control systems, tracks in disrepair and you have your recipe for disaster.

ECS-3
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USA / Virginia

Feb 5th, 2018 07:49 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

My understanding is that Positive Train Control was originally mandated to be installed by the end of 2015. And that deadline has been extended to the end of 2018.

And Congress will probably extend it further so they have blood on their hands.

HeavyDuty
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Northeast IL

Not very bright but does lack ambition
Feb 5th, 2018 08:04 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

The issue with PTC is that the technology is still catching up with the mandate. A friend is a signal engineer for one of the Class 1s, and it sounds like it has been a disaster. FCC coordination for the new radio infrastructure has been a major roadblock.

ECS-3
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USA / Virginia

Feb 5th, 2018 09:01 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

"FCC coordination for the new radio infrastructure has been a major roadblock. "

So there's an area where the Federal Government could help thing along, if they wanted to.

K4
Contributing Member
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Being defenseless

does not make you more safe
Feb 5th, 2018 09:05 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I think a lot of regulatory red tape is being repealed.

HeavyDuty
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Northeast IL

Not very bright but does lack ambition
Feb 5th, 2018 10:23 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

That's my understanding, too. An example I was told:

PTC requires a network of radio towers. FCC has been requiring the railroads to submit the application for each installation individually, and then takes forever to approve them all - but usually leaves holes in the coverage instead of approving entire routes. These holes take months to resolve.

Apparently someone in .gov came down on FCC for that. One hand (FCC) not knowing or caring what the other hand (Congress) is doing and mandating. A good example of how regulatory agency autocracy and bureaucracy is killing us.

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FDP Forum / Moe's Tavern (_8^(I) / Another Amtrak Accident!




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