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FDP Forum / Miscellaneous and Non-Fender Topics / Vintage tubes vs new production tubes

Previous 20 Messages  
rfrakes331K
Contributing Member
*******

IL USA

RonHalen Jokingly He Says
Jun 16th, 2017 01:52 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Also made during a time when OSHA wasn't around. They were also many made for mils peculiar applications. More vibration resistant!

champster
Contributing Member
*********

Oceanside, CA

Jun 16th, 2017 05:44 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

How come when I use JJ 6V6 tubes they sound like 6V6 tubes to me? Any amp with 6L6s sound way different to me. Guess I'm hearing different than everyone else.

Tony F

Long Island, NY

When you come to fork in road take it
Jun 16th, 2017 06:10 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

champster pop it out and put in most any other 6v6gt and you'll hear earlier breakup. Try it, just a/b it in your amp.
Now pop in a 1950's Ken Rad 6V6 GT and you'll be a believer.
I don't want to debate with my fellow FDP'ers I posted this to share something I discovered after 50 years of playing tube amps.


champster
Contributing Member
*********

Oceanside, CA

Jun 16th, 2017 06:29 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I've done it all and all power tubes from different companies have their own character.

I have a number of RCA, Brimar, and Mazda 6V6 tubes on hand. I use new because that's what I want to use and they're cheap. I use what works for me. If a cheap tube from where ever works for me, I'm in. It's just about playing, even if people hate how I sound. I f enjoy it and it makes me want to keep playing then that's a good combination.

BbendFender
Contributing Member
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American Patriot

About as ordinary as you can get.
Jun 16th, 2017 08:37 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I use used tubes in all of my Fender amps and I have since my old band got back together in 1997. I had a couple old Fenders worked on by a tech and he put new JJ's in the output section. I still like the old tubes better. I have been building up my supply of these tubes and I have a lifetime supply and more at this point, especially 12AX7 and 12AT7.
We all have to use what we like and what we think sounds good to us.

stratcowboy
Contributing Member
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USA/Taos, NM

Jun 16th, 2017 09:21 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

"If enjoy it and it makes me want to keep playing then that's a good combination."

"We all have to use what we like and what we think sounds good to us."

Absolutely on both those counts.

A good number of years ago I bought a whole mess of tubes, including NOS, to do a round-robin of listening experiments. At the time, my main amp was a Peavey Delta Blues w/a Weber California (15") in it. I spent a good number of hours and days going through 12AX7 after 12AX7 (and of course, ECC83s). Even though I had some NOS tubes of great reputation in the mix, my favorite sounding tube came out to be the modern day Tung Sol 12AX7. So that's what I stuck with.

After reading all the NOS postings, I was sure I was missing something. That's why I made the purchase and did the work/experiment.

Both my amps today are made by David Allen. When talking to him, his comments said basically the same as others have here. That he looks for tubes that are reliable and sound good, regardless of who makes them or where they come from. That's become my method as well.

Works for me. YMMV...

Modal Magic
Contributing Member
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MBJ, Highway Hound.

You Can't Bend It Aussie!
Jun 17th, 2017 06:36 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

If the tubes I use provide bell-like juicy tones, touch sensitivity, and a good point can be found that changes from clean to overdriven/distorted tones as a result of playing dynamics I'm happy. I have yet to find modern production tubes that don't do what I ask.

Edit- clarity and note definition clean and distorted is also important too.

(This message was last edited by Modal Magic at 08:39 AM, Jun 17th, 2017)

picnic
Contributing Member
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********

NJ/FLA

I like guitars and amps
Jun 22nd, 2017 11:02 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I'm losing my affection for JJ's. They don't last as long as they use to, that's for sure. I replaced a quad of EL84's in my Mesa LSS this morning after it started blowing fuses. New tubes are not blowing the fuse.
Last winter a bad 30 day JJ EL84 damaged my 2 Peavey Classic 30's.

Pinetree
Moderator Emeritus
(with many stars)

NW Pennsylvania

Jun 22nd, 2017 11:42 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Blowing fuses is more likely a capacitor thing.




Leftee
Contributing Member
*****

VA

My Fame is Cropped
Jun 22nd, 2017 07:00 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

A bad output tube can take the HT fuse.

Tony F

Long Island, NY

When you come to fork in road take it
Jun 23rd, 2017 07:18 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Alos a bad power tube can also blow a fuse. In my blues junior the fuse blew and it turned out to be a bad EL84 (JJ btw).

QUESTION Why are current production 6V6's larger than there vintage counterparts? Anybody?


rfrakes331K
Contributing Member
*******

IL USA

RonHalen Jokingly He Says
Jun 27th, 2017 10:50 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

picnic , If you bought matched sets of EL84s from Mesa Boogie and didn't get the pairs matched so that 2 Grey rated tubes and 2 other color are together, or their matching is in error, this will cause a runaway conditionand blow the fuse and might blow the Rectifier tube also. I had such a problem.

DrKev
Contributing Member
*****

Paris, France

It's just a guitar, not rocket science.
Jun 27th, 2017 11:49 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I'm curious - how does this cause a runaway condition? Sets of tubes that are matched initially can quickly drift out of match, by as much as 15%, and still perform well for a long time. So how much mismatch would be too much?

Hammond101
Contributing Member
**********

So. Cal. USA

Jun 27th, 2017 12:10 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I'm curious too.

I use what sounds good to me in my amps. I don't do the NOS or vintage thing. At the end of the day an audience can't tell what tubes you are using.

There may be some merit with the NOS/vintage stuff if you are in the studio but for my money when putting countless hours on my amps pounding the pavement and stage, new production is more than adequate. No Issues with JJ tubes here.

rfrakes331K
Contributing Member
*******

IL USA

RonHalen Jokingly He Says
Jun 27th, 2017 12:22 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

As it was explained to me, the Mesa Boogie LSS is hybrid Class A. The 2 output tubes run class A together and must be matched.

Roger Ball
Contributing Member
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******

Canada

New guitars, old amps. Perfect.
Jun 27th, 2017 02:55 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

The only bad experience I've had with a new production tube was a 5AR4 rectifier that decided to suddenly give up the ghost and turn white. I've had good luck with current TAD power tubes and assorted new preamp tubes.





RainboGuy

USA/Wisconsin

Ike Turner is my guitar hero!
Jun 27th, 2017 09:15 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Roger Ball:

If you ever heard the tonal difference that you get from using a true vintage NOS Mullard 5ar4 vs a current 5ar4 from any manufacturer, you would be amazed....let alone that they seem to last forever.

Sometimes a set of GREAT vintage tubes in your amp coupled with a well-researched speaker swap make ALL THE TONAL DIFFERENCE IN THE WORLD.

LeftyMeister

Buckeye Country, USA

Motorcycles, Guitars, and Golf
Jun 30th, 2017 10:15 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

My amp tech is well-known in our area and has several clients we'd all recognize. He's told me that tubes today are not built to the same quality as NOS tubes. First, the vacuum being pulled today is not nearly as high because the compressors being used by the tube industry are much smaller. Secondly, the materials are inferior including thinner glass, plates, wire, etc. In short, new tubes are not nearly as robust.

(This message was last edited by LeftyMeister at 12:55 PM, Jun 30th, 2017)

jazzguy

Philly, B-3 Capital

don't dream it be it
Jun 30th, 2017 11:06 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I only use NOS tubes. for awhile I used newer tubes and found they died way too quickly.
I have a very nice stash of NOS that I dip into from time to time.
yesterday I installed a NOS quad of Phillips big bottle STR-387's in my blackface Twin.
the last quad I installed was used @ the time, but I got 13 yrs out of them.

not only do they sound better, but you can normally put them in and not have to worry about them failing like many new tubes do.

even though they're more expensive it's worth it to me.


jhawkr
Contributing Member
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Wichita, KS USA

It's all gravy from here on...
Jun 30th, 2017 11:16 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

My 1973 Bandmaster Reverb has all original RCA's except 1 12AX7. They still all test in the "new range". NOS tubes are just more reliable.

Previous 20 Messages  

FDP Forum / Miscellaneous and Non-Fender Topics / Vintage tubes vs new production tubes




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