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FDP Forum / Amp Mods, Repairs, and Projects / 65 DRRI Not Doin' It

Previous 20 Messages  
NHILL1

United States

Oct 28th, 2016 12:28 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Well I may try the bias suggestion, but I can say I've tried every bias within the range of the amp. From 16 ma to 27 ma, and I always came back to 23 ma because it sounded the best clean.

PDF64, all the "blackface" mods are is fromel mods more or less. All it did was make the amp cleaner sounding, kind of more twin like.

I played with the amp this morning and what I find is that the sound just isn't "touch sensitive", until I turned the treble to 9 and bass 5. The only problem is the amp is super bright at this point, but it makes chords and lead work cut through. I actually like how the amp sounds when the knobs are set like this, but it takes away some of the sweetness of the amp; though the cost of "sweetness" is dull and muddy sounding bass end.

Sweet sounding - bass 3 treble 7
Cutting/better managed bass end - bass 5 treble 9

I appreciate all the responses, I can only say from my experience the amp prefers 23 ma as opposed to a higher bias. It's still up for sale, so I'll monitor it for awhile and I may let it go. I still cling to it because I'll never recover the cost I put into the amp, but I think at the end of the day I'd prefer a super reverb as my favorite artists use it and I always like how it sounds, though I never have been able to play one.

I'd really prefer a trade so I wouldn't have to eat so much cost, but I'll see what happens.

catnineblue

LA , Calif

I try my best
Oct 28th, 2016 01:23 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Aren't these Fender RI amps basically PC boards with very small components? I've read they are not a true RI. Saw some You Tube video of some fellow gutting his and turning it into a real eyelet board think it was a PRRI.

Hammond101
Contributing Member
**********

So. Cal. USA

Oct 28th, 2016 01:52 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Although the DRRI is said to be the best of the '65 RI series, even a really healthy one can be bit brash and harsh to my ears. Not a favorite of mine. I think clipping the bright cap out of the vibrato channel helps quite a bit to calm the thing. The reverb is not as good on the RI amps as on the originals. Tank swaps can help but you may go through a couple before you find a sweet one.

For a 22 watt 2-6V6 circuit they are loud amps. All of the Fender blackface circuits and the RIs have to be cranked to get them to break up on their own. A boost pedal may help this and hit the front end harder and help you a bit here.

The Super Reverb will be louder and cleaner (and much heavier!) You are really moving some air when these amps hit the sweet spot. They have enough treble to rip your head off and cut through in just about any situation. Great loud cleans to a point then baby here it comes. If the DRRI is too loud this won't do much for you in that department

The SRRI works much better after the factory tube are replaced and the amp is re-biased. Most are too cold and the factory grove tubes are the cheapest available.

I've never found any of the Fender '65 RI series not to take pedals well. Taking pedals is one of the things most people love about these amps.

Back to the DRRI, you might want to try a 5751 preamp tube in place of V2, a 12AX7, if you use the vibrato channel. Put it in V1 if you use the normal channel. This tube has a little less gain and may help you out in the clean department. In some amps this improves warmth IMO.

NHILL1

United States

Oct 28th, 2016 02:17 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Hi Hammond, let me re-state my issue with the clean sound. I don't really care about turning the amp up loud, it's just when the DRRI is clean, it doesn't feel like it has the headroom I want. It stays compressed and dirty sounding, or if I set the amp differently bright and kind of stale. So it's more like the one thing it should be doing good, it only does okay at.

I want the SRRI because I want more air flow/head room/cleaner sound. If I get the chance to turn it up great, but I'll be playing clean 99.9% of the time. So I just want a more malleable amp. Also, I really think I've come to the conclusion it just isn't the amp I want. I've literally tried swapping everything in the amp in terms of speakers and tubes, and eventually just came back to it's stock form because it sounded the best that way, but it still isn't the sound for me.

So like the title says I just don't think the amp is doing it for me. So I'll sell it, and if I'm able I'm going to try and buy a used 65 SRRI and get a good deal, hopefully coming out even.

catnineblue

LA , Calif

I try my best
Oct 28th, 2016 02:34 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I find it difficult to believe after I just chatted with Fender that all the RI amps are PCB circuits with much smaller resistors and filter caps and everything build in a PC board that they can sound like an original.

That was one reason I sold my 94 tweed deluxe and Pro Jr . They sounded great until the pC mounted sockets gave it up on the Pro Jr. I just assumed the were tube amps built like the old days. The Pro Jr that gave me issues was a 2001 model still made in the USA that I had to repair the one power tube socket.

They do this to keep the price low and it began in 94 with the Pro Jr and Blues Deluxe. Once I took the back off the 2001 Pro Jr I was surprised to see PC boards and ribbon wire .

Even the Super reverb RI is PCB based even though the tubes at least mount to the chassis and not a board with ribbon wire same idea Pignose had with their G40V .

That's when I got into building my own amps the old way.

Iron Man
Moderator

USA/Frisco Bay

My eyes are blind, but I can see
Oct 28th, 2016 11:59 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Maybe it's just me, but I find the DRRI as is, to be super clean, sometimes too much to my ears. My issue is that I'd like it to growl at low volumes. Raising the bias is getting me there so I can easily alternate and mix super clean with a bit of dirt.

BbendFender
Contributing Member
*********

American Patriot

I'm on guard these days.
Oct 29th, 2016 09:40 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

More and more issues with these Fender "reissue" amps that aren't even close to being a reissue.

ECS-3
Contributing Member
**********
*

USA / Virginia

Oct 29th, 2016 10:12 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

If you don't like the amp, I'd sell it and get something you like better.

LeftRightOut
Contributing Member
*****

Australia

too many guitars and not enough hands
Oct 30th, 2016 05:22 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Tone is subjective, some like the amps some don't

What is it specifically that you want from the amp? Or what do you want your amp to do?

It could be a speaker change is what's needed but, that's a whole nother can of worms


Peegoo
Contributing Member
**********
**********
******

Onward

Christian Slater
Oct 30th, 2016 09:43 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

ECS-3 +1,000.

If you like the amp and everything it does, but it needs a teensy 'nudge' in one area, then yes--modify the circuit to see if it makes the nut for you.

If the amp in general makes you go, "Meh," then by all means don't try to turn it into something it never was intended to be. If all parts are in spec, then that is what it sounds like. You can repaint a tiger to look like a zebra, but it will be painful and it will still be a tiger in the end.

Unload the amp and get one that does what you want *right out of the gate*.

NHILL1

United States

Oct 30th, 2016 01:12 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Peegoo, the thing I'm hearing/feeling is there bass frequencies that aren't able to be dialed out. It's really a feel thing, when I hit a barre chord, it feels as if there's distance between what I'm playing, and what's coming out of the amp. By distance I just mean some kind of mud, or weird frequencies that aren't supposed to be there.

Anyways, it really is a stellar sounding amp, it just bothers me because I feel like I can't play chords or do double stops on the bass strings without getting this out-of-sync feeling with the amp, and weird bass frequencies. I hate to sell it, but at the end of the day I can't justify holding onto a problem. Everytime I play it I analyze it because there's just something not right. It could be just fine for some people, but just not for me.

LeftRightOut
Contributing Member
*****

Australia

too many guitars and not enough hands
Oct 30th, 2016 03:28 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

So it sounds like a flubby bass type issue?

a Weber Cali will fix that

Then a speaker change is needed but since you don't want to burn to much cash to find out see if anyone you know has one in an amp to try out before you layout any dough.

If not sell the amp and move on

Peegoo
Contributing Member
**********
**********
******

Onward

Christian Slater
Oct 30th, 2016 03:34 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Try playing the amp through an extension speaker cabinet with the internal speaker disconnected and see if the weird low-end content issue persists.

Have the amp on the floor and the extension cab on the floor. Don't stack them.

It may be a vibration-induced oscillation of a component in the circuit that's causing the problem.



Guitar Fool
Contributing Member
**********
*******

Sunshine State

Just a pawn in someone else's game
Oct 30th, 2016 04:41 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

catnineblue...

u nailed it...... I had a early 90's Blues Deluxe that just never did it for me.... I liked it at first but the sound soured with me over time....

and the fact that all it took was one time to step on the cord and break the input off of the PCB was the clincher..

I'll never buy another amp built that way..


Iron Man
Moderator

USA/Frisco Bay

My eyes are blind, but I can see
Oct 31st, 2016 12:45 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

NHILL1 :
The DRRI doesn't sound like what you're describing. Either the amp you have has serious issues or it simply doesn't fit your musical taste. If you want to give the DRRI another chance, test drive another one at GC, otherwise dump it!!

pdf64

UK

Oct 31st, 2016 04:05 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

"all the "blackface" mods are is fromel mods more or less"

Haha, this contains no meaningful info.

It seems bizarre to modify an amp that has the BF circuit with 'blackface mods'!

My reading of the situation is that you have an amp that was likely not working correctly which has then been subjected to likely ill conceived, possibly poorly implemented, mods.

The amp may just have a bad tube; please let's eliminate the basics first.



Hammond101
Contributing Member
**********

So. Cal. USA

Oct 31st, 2016 10:02 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

pdf has some good thoughts there. Amps with mods are often a problem. Reading all this again if in fact the amp is working correctly are you playing a high output humbucker through it? Have you tried other guitars? Does it clean up if you back off the volume knob on the guitar?

That preamp tube swap I mentioned above might help that.

Even the DRRI has decent clean headroom to a point. If your just playing at home at modest volumes you are either overdriving the preamp section of something is wrong.

If the amp doesn't make you happy then yes, sell it and find one that does.

NHILL1

United States

Oct 31st, 2016 02:57 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Okay well I think I found out the issue more or less. All I did was turn the bass down to 2 and treble up to 8, and that weird "mud" frequency got dialed out. The cost is the sound is thinner than where I've always kept the amp (treble 7 bass 3), but I feel like the blanket was taken off, which was driving me crazy. Now when I switch to the neck pickup I'm in vintage tone heaven with my strat, I could play that clean tone all day. It may not be perfect, but it's ridiculously better than having a ton of ugly bass that just sags for days.

Long story short, I knew the amp sounded good, I just couldn't figure out why I couldn't mesh with it. For whatever reason I was convinced the amp was best on treble 7 bass 3, and even though it sounded okay I got pissed of just not being happy with my sound and let my ears do the work they pointed me in the right direction. I could post a video just to display the tone I am getting now and I couldn't imagine it'd come across youtube, but still I really do enjoy what I'm getting now compared to what it was before.

Also pdf64, all the mods did was replace some of the filter capacitors with high quality components and make the sound much more clean, sort of twin like. I remember before and after playing the amp and there was an audible difference, is that meaningful enough?

(This message was last edited by NHILL1 at 05:12 PM, Oct 31st, 2016)

rmfrance

France

Nov 4th, 2016 02:45 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Well, my DRRI is obviously not typical. I can hear it starting to compress from 4 1/2, and by 6 I can wave 'clean' goodbye.
I have the cap bypass mod, plus reverb switchable on both channels, but can't see that altering headroom significantly. I play mostly with a rhythm-section who are not exactly animals, but I still often run the volume on 9 on smallish bar-type gigs.
Now I'm considering a speaker swap, to gain som extra efficiency, and thus volume - I won't be selling this amp, though, as it's warm, creamy and just feels part of me.

NHILL1

United States

Nov 9th, 2016 04:36 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Just an update, I was foolish to think about selling the amp. It just so happend that I had to go without it for a couple of days and I was so bummed not having it, the clean tone just can't be matched by my blues jr, even though it sounds good. That said, part of the problem I was experiencing was I think I had been driving the preamp to hard as my pickups were set high, I lowered them down and the amp sounds cleaner at the same volume and the bass isn't getting in the way as much. Anyways, just thought I'd update, end result, the amp is amazing even with it's faults. I would be not-so-smart to let it go, so long as it doesn't keep breaking down on me.

I tried to retension all the tubes and ended up messing something up. I opened the amp back up after it being broken down for about a week, retensioned and applied deoxit to the tubes and it worked again.

(This message was last edited by NHILL1 at 06:39 PM, Nov 9th, 2016)

Previous 20 Messages  

FDP Forum / Amp Mods, Repairs, and Projects / 65 DRRI Not Doin' It




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