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FDP Forum / The Chop Shop / Do you tend to learn songs "naked"....

super mario
Contributing Member
*********

USA

tone to the bone no other way
Nov 13th, 2015 06:55 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Not what you are thinking, but without "effects" to clutter the learning. I was going over some of the songs I have played a number of years with just the guitar and amp. All of a sudden I could hear the clunks and clinks of missed notes, poorly fretted fingers, etc. Thinking I need to get back to just the guitar-cable-amp to really learn the stuff and then "color" it later when I know what my fingers are doing.....in other words, I need to go back to learning songs on the guitar like I do on the bass.....naked

urby
Contributing Member
*******

Seattle, Wa

Not quite my tempo
Nov 13th, 2015 12:04 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I always thought that if I ever did a You Tube lesson on how to play a song I would use a fairly clean tone. After hearing a few lessons with too much OD or distortion it seems that a clean tone simply makes what you're trying to teach easier to hear. Add the "effectrs" later.

littleuch
Contributing Member
**********
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Florida

Stale bread and flea circuses
Nov 13th, 2015 01:48 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

If the effect is integral to the part, then I say make it part of the lesson.

urby
Contributing Member
*******

Seattle, Wa

Not quite my tempo
Nov 13th, 2015 01:55 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

"If the effect is integral to the part, then I say make it part of the lesson. "

Howzabout playing it through clean first, to get the notes and then a second time with needed effects to get the feel?

Tyrone Shuz

USA

I'm all in!
Nov 15th, 2015 06:27 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Unless you're dealing with an infinite sustain situation, I see no reason to use anything other than a clean tone. I teach with a clean tone. My amp does have OD so I can demonstrate on rare occasions but I teach clean.

My Youtube trailer vid has OD but it's a performance over tracks (at the end) and not a lesson.

I am sure there are other exceptions where an effect is warranted, but my point is, those occasions are few.

littleuch
Contributing Member
**********
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Florida

Stale bread and flea circuses
Nov 15th, 2015 06:30 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Yeah, I was talking about things like dotted 8th note delay solos and such. Overall, probably few occasions.

Tyrone Shuz

USA

I'm all in!
Nov 15th, 2015 11:05 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Learning stuff with timed delays, or 12-string parts, really need to be learned "naked" first because the effects are so prominent, it's difficult to pick out the actual part.

But one would be inconsiderate if one showed the part, and the not how the effect is applied.

super mario
Contributing Member
*********

USA

tone to the bone no other way
Nov 17th, 2015 12:35 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Great comments guys....seems I am working in a better direction by working on songs "naked. For the first time in a long time, I feel I am working towards the next level of understanding in this thing we call "music".

cagey
Contributing Member
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Canada

numb, yes...comfortable? Not so much
Dec 12th, 2015 03:50 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I tend to learn/practice new songs on the acoustic, then start playing with sounds & tones on the electric

side-swipeTelecaster

The Free World

The New World Order is DOOMED...
Dec 14th, 2015 05:36 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

All depends. I can remember years ago before understanding how tubes & certain circuit influences had an impact on tone-----and getting frustrated & annoyed at not being able to get my guitars/amps to sound the right way...

Indeed after learning how to play the guitar well through a decent clean tone ss amp, and at the same time learning a bit more about how tube amps can and do affect overall tone, sound, and feel----I went to playing through a hybrid amp w/variable watt output and haven't looked back ever since....

larryguitar19
Contributing Member
**

South Florida

larryguitar
Dec 16th, 2015 01:14 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Same as Cagey. I learn everything on an acoustic first. The electric hides all the mistakes. I need to hear it clean first.

Dolemite
Contributing Member
********

What It Was!

smells like Persian cab driver ass
Dec 16th, 2015 01:16 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

No - I wear flippers and a tiara.

Technically, I am NOT naked.

6stringlust

Southeast USA

Mar 21st, 2016 09:33 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Super Mario,
I agree with playing naked! My learning experience started circa '64-65 I was 12-13 yrs old and had a Stella accoustic. We didn't have effects to speak of, tab nor anything else like that. I liked the Ventures and Chuck Berry. For printed music there were songbooks. I wore out all the Ventures and Beach Boys stuff then the Beatles hit. For chords and sight reading there were the Micky Baker and Mel Bay volumes too. Then, I heard the Bluesbreakers w/Clapton '66-'67, Peter Green, Mick Taylor, Howlin Wolf and Albert King. Then, everything went south from there! A little later when I saw Hendrix for the 1st time ('68) all he had was a wah-wah. So in those days, fx were not in our frame of reference. With the music I learned on and except for maybe reverb we didn't have anything that would cloud the sounds/tones when practicing. I guess what I'm saying, and this being only my opinion, is when learning to play beneath layers of effects, there is too much to hide crappy technique, lack of knowledge and just plain old mistakes. I just feel that when learning note and chord techniques, a new player does his/her self a huge disservice by, even if unknowingly, hiding beneath layers of effects.

Otoh, and as alluded to previously, if someone can already play and is trying to cover a tune in which effects are an integral part, well, ok. For ex if someone wants to learn a Police tune or cover Hendrix and can already play and is wanting to get the tones and sounds spot on, then sure... incorporate the effects. In that case, I suppose the effects are just as much of a part of the song as the chord progression or melody. Otherwise, forget it. Get on the bridge pickup of a Telecaster, set the amp on the cleanest, brightest, most ice-picky, non warm tone(s) that can be conjured, THEN learn your scales, chords, hammer-ons, pull-offs, double stops and other techniques. Of course I am exaggerating a little here but that could go a long way toward getting "tone from the hands" as some call it. After practicing in that sonic environment, then when picking up a Strat, ES-335 or LP, one is more likely to sound better at least as it relates to tone. Its the same principle as when a ball player takes practice swings with a weighted bat before stepping into the batter's box. (does anyone still do that?? !!)

Anyway, just my opinion but as they say, I'm stickin' to it. Btw, this was very wordy... if you got this far, thanks for indulging me and reading all of this.

(This message was last edited by 6stringlust at 11:56 AM, Mar 21st, 2016)

MLC
Contributing Member
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***

It's not just good..

...it's good enough.
Mar 21st, 2016 10:11 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I almost always learn new songs on an unplugged electric. Or on an acoustic.

I always figured if I can't play something clean, it isn't going to sound any better when I start stepping on pedals.
Get the basics down first before you start adding all the bells and whistles.

shunka

Willoughby, OH , USA

I'm arrogant and a moron
Mar 21st, 2016 11:09 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

To me, the song is the melody, and the chord structure. Everything else is the arrangement. I generally "leran" or work out the song on an acoustic. Then I'll learn the signature riffs, if any, (i.e. intros, outros, bass lines that are closely identified with the song). Sometimes the riff is necessary to the song. Think of PLAY THAT FUNKY MUSIC or PRETTY WOMAN.

FDP Forum / The Chop Shop / Do you tend to learn songs "naked"....




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