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FDP Forum / Fender Bass Guitars and Bass Amps / Harke Kickback 10 farting out

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wrnchbndr
Contributing Member
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New Jersey

The otters threw me out
Mar 13th, 2012 07:36 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Hey folks, I'm not really a bass player but I'm called on to fake it quite often when our real bass player looses heart or drinks too much. I fake it pretty well and really enjoy it when I pull it off. Anyway, I picked up a Harke Kickback 10 with a blown speaker as a practice amp. It is a 120watt amp and it comes in a very small package about the size of a stage monitor. I installed an Eminence Delta 10B and the amp farts out above 5 on the volume knob. I can dial back the output of the bass but I still get the problem at the same volume level and the same goes for tweeking up the bass response on the EQ. I have four of these speakers and they all do the same thing. The speaker is supposed to be rated for 350watts. I bought these speakers in a factory close out deal from a supplier that has really been good to me in the past. When I connect the amp to a decent external bass speaker cabinet I get really decent clean thump all of the way to 10. Now when I read the reviews on this amp, I see quite a few instances of the original aluminum cone Harke speaker self destructing after a period of time but I never see any issues with the amp farting out until about 9 on the volume knob. Do you think that this might be as simple as buying a better quality speaker? ... and are there suggestions?

uncle stack-knob
Contributing Member
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united kingdom

Mar 13th, 2012 11:51 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Initially, my thoughts are ... It's the speaker.
Maybe the close outs were returns or DOA's or something.I have always thought that the only place for ten inch speakers was either hiding inside an Ampeg 8/10 or a Trace Elliot 1410h.

The idea being that you need lots of them to roll with the low end.


Stack-Knob.

wrnchbndr
Contributing Member
*******

New Jersey

The otters threw me out
Mar 13th, 2012 02:07 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I'm really thinking the same thing -- I got a batch of defective speakers.

Vince A

USA/Modesto, CA

Mar 13th, 2012 06:05 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Before you run off to purchase new speakers . . . if it's a sealed cab, make sure that you plug any extraneous (unused) speakon and 1/4 inch holes with foam ear plugs, etc. I know that my cabs will also fart if those holes are not plugged, and I have the stock speakers!

Bubbalou
Contributing Member
**********

USA

THE LOW END OF UPPER TEJAS
Mar 13th, 2012 07:13 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

"I know that my cabs will also fart if those holes are not plugged, and I have the stock speakers!"

+1

I also had to remove the control panel on my Avatar Bass Cab and put weather striping around the back side edges then secure it back into place.

wrnchbndr
Contributing Member
*******

New Jersey

The otters threw me out
Mar 14th, 2012 07:29 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

The cab has a 2 1/2 round port at the rear. I have built a matching extention cab in the exact same form as the amp but with a rectangular port in the front taking place of the volume that the electronics would and it farts at exactly the same volume level. I have an opportunity to acquire a pair of new 200watt RMS Peavey speakers for a great price and I'll try these. If they don't make things right, I'll just build a 2X10 cab and sell it at cost or keep it myself as something handy.

aerodyne

USA

Mar 14th, 2012 05:49 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

This may sound weird but my Fender BXR65 bass combo does the same thing.
The amp puts out 65watts and I installed a 300watt Carvin bass speaker.
Could it be that when a speaker is WAY over rated and used with a lower wattage amp,the speaker may start to fart when turned up? aero

JohnS

USA

Mar 14th, 2012 06:05 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Is the speaker rated as the same ohms as the amp?
Try and match the original or get an original spkr.
My SWR Workingman's 10 does not fart out, but it whistles if the ports arn't pluged.
Good luck.

kcshowman
Contributing Member
******

Los Angeles

If I only have one bass to play...
Mar 14th, 2012 06:46 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Nobody is considering that the amp is defective or is being over-driven. Not saying this is the culprit but the speaker may be faithfully reproducing the signal that is being fed to it.

Twangmeister
Contributing Member
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E NC

Top dog in a litter of mutts
Mar 14th, 2012 07:55 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

"The cab has a 2 1/2 round port at the rear."

In the medical field we refer to the port in the rear as the rectum.

wrnchbndr
Contributing Member
*******

New Jersey

The otters threw me out
Mar 15th, 2012 05:57 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Nope, the amp is okay. It sounds great when using a decent cabinet all of the way to 10 and is silly loud for such a tiny package. I'm totally clear that I won't get the kwhop and ooompf of a big cabinet and the post is really about deciding if these speakers were defective. I had lots of thought about reflective energy, standing wave forms and maybe speakers that uniquely are intollerent of being in small enclosures.

Caca de Kick
Contributing Member
**

Seattle/Tacoma WA

Mar 15th, 2012 01:11 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I think asking one single little speaker to do any bass volume on a gig is simply asking too much. It doesn't matter what it's rating is, it's is only going to handle X-amount of excursion then it's done for. Especially when these kick-back cabs are on the small side for cab tuning.

BrentD
Contributing Member
****

Lansing, MI

Mar 15th, 2012 01:20 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Is it possible to get an OEM aluminum cone speaker? They're not everyone's favorite, but I'd wager the amp was designed with one of those little guys in mind.

EDIT because I didn't realize the British sense of the word hadn't changed the way it did here. Sorry, Stack!

(This message was last edited by BrentD at 08:20 AM, Mar 17th, 2012)

uncle stack-knob
Contributing Member
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united kingdom

Mar 15th, 2012 03:41 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

BrentD.. No offence meant, but is there any chance that you might stop swearing on this forum?
I find it somewhat offensive, and un-needed.

Stack-Knob.

wrnchbndr
Contributing Member
*******

New Jersey

The otters threw me out
Mar 15th, 2012 04:10 PM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Uncle Stack, We don't use the word the same way over here. I'm sure its the same origin but it has totally lost its actual meaning here in the states. Often we use it to refer to a misbehaving small child.

uncle stack-knob
Contributing Member
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united kingdom

Mar 16th, 2012 01:36 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

O.K. Thanks, apologies to BrentD, really.

Sure has a different meaning over here!

:O) Stack-Knob.

6G6

Texas

Fender power to the people!
Mar 16th, 2012 04:39 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

I think the speaker is the problem, if it si OK with a known good external cabinet.
The 350 watt rating is the thermal limit.
That means it won't burn the voice coil at that power.
The problem is likely that it has a low Xmax.
That is the travel limit.
The only way one 10 is ever gonna put out much bass, is if it moves a long way.
If that one just isn't able to do that, it will sound bad.

Steve Dallman
Contributing Member
*****

Merrill, Wisconsin

Ain't turned 60, but I got my blinker on
Mar 16th, 2012 08:09 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Xmax (maximum linear excursion) is 1.8 mm which is low. By comparison a Beta 10 is 3.0, and a Delta Lite is 4.8 mm. Usable frequency low end is 71Hz with that speaker. Wattage ratings are taken at much higher frequencies. For instance, I use a Kappa Pro 15 which is rated at 600 watts or there a bouts. Below 100 Hz power handling drops to well below 100 watts.

The excursion limits are the problem with the Delta.

fsmith
Contributing Member
*******

Mi.

Mar 16th, 2012 08:24 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Those Aluminum cones are available direct from Samson.

wrnchbndr
Contributing Member
*******

New Jersey

The otters threw me out
Mar 17th, 2012 08:00 AM   Edit   Profile   Print Topic   Search Topic

Steve, Do you know of a good web tutorial or a publication that you recommend concerning speaker performance characteristics and cabinet issues? I work in a music store and really need to improve my knowledge base so I don't fill in the blanks with bull. I know enough about speakers to only be dangerous.

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FDP Forum / Fender Bass Guitars and Bass Amps / Harke Kickback 10 farting out




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