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FDP Forum / Fender Guitars: Telecasters / My Tele Custom sounds much better now and it cost $0
FDP Forum / Fender Guitars: Telecasters / My Tele Custom sounds much better now and it cost $0
Next 20 Messages
PaulinPac
Contributing Member
San FranciscoApr 17th, 2008 02:26 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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I love my CIJ Tele Custom, It's an amazing guitar construction, sound and playability are near the best of any of my guitars, but despite the overall very good sound, the Wider Range pup is sort of a dog by itself, hot but muffled and dull sounding. I could get some great sounds combining it with the bridge and fiddling with the volume, tone etc, but it's a pain to do while playing.
I wanted to keep the guitar looking stock, and as y'all probably know there basically aren't any drop in replacements, so I called Lindy Fralin about rewinding it for a brighter, edgier tone. After spending about 20 minutes talking with me (what a guy -amazing) he suggested something pretty unusual; take out the pup, remove the hidden pole pieces completely, put it back and drop down the pup quite a bit (basically flat with the body) and then raise the exposed pole pieces back up to normal distance from the strings.
Much better. It's quite a bit brighter with less of that muffled quality, and is also more balanced with the bridge pup power-wise (although it's still louder). The pup still doesn't have a lot of edge, but the sound is really quite nice, and is now also usable by itself. It's a good free fix for anyone not thrilled with the RI WR pups.
Paul
thedavide
Contributing Member
Toronto, CanadaApr 19th, 2008 06:43 AM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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I heard that just by changing the volume and tone pot to 500K, the pickup will sound incredible.
trustee
USA/Somerville, MAApr 19th, 2008 02:44 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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No idea why 250k pots r stock either...
Matti
FinlandApr 20th, 2008 06:28 AM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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Baja Tele sound certainly opened up when I modded the pots. I changed the carbon ring to 500k for the S1 vol pot and scraped a "no load groove" for the tone pot. TWANGGGGGGG!
http://www.projectguitar.com/tut/pots.htm
PaulinPac
Contributing Member
San FranciscoApr 21st, 2008 06:30 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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I had already put a 1 meg vol pot in shortly after I first got the guitar, and at the same time put a no load tone control in (so on '10' it's a bypass). Those definately helped some, but this made as much or more of a difference overall, specifically dealing with that sort of 'muffled' quality. So I think this is now about as good as these reissue WR pickups can sound.
Paul
wade truckerson
USAApr 22nd, 2008 02:08 AM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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I myself have 500k pots and bypassed tone controls, and feel like that's given me the sound i want with the exception of the muddiness that remains in the bass. I'm interested in clearing it up without really changing the overall character of the pickup, so i wanted to ask if there are any other changes besides improved clarity and treble. is the fullness of the sound reduced? or is the tone changed in any other ways you can describe? thanks for posting this by the way, i've never heard of anyone doing this before
PaulinPac
Contributing Member
San FranciscoApr 22nd, 2008 03:57 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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It's definately less muddy in the bass, has a decent sound and to me it's now totally usable by itself where it really wasn't so much before. Does it sound like some world-class awesome scatterwound humbucker? No. But yes, it does retain the basic overall tone of the pup with increased clarity and decreased mud, and better balance. It's definately a real improvement. Also easy to try and experiment with.
trustee
USA/Somerville, MAApr 22nd, 2008 04:15 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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I just ordered some 500k pots and RS caps we'll see how that plays into effect. Also, I've noticed that I'm not getting good string response (volume) from the Low E, A, and D...any suggestions?
wade truckerson
USAApr 22nd, 2008 04:55 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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i had to adjust the polepieces extensively to get the pickups to sound right. if you haven't already, i'd spend a while experimenting with different heights, specifically by raising those three strings' polepieces up.
i'll try removing the hidden polepieces tonight and let you know how it works for me.
wade truckerson
USAApr 22nd, 2008 09:35 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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i removed the pieces and it works well. everything is exactly as paulinpac said, the sound is completely clear now and the bass is much better. there's also a lot more detail and definition. everyone with a wide range pickup should try it
trustee
USA/Somerville, MAApr 23rd, 2008 08:56 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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one thing I want to mention here that is the CIJ WR pickups are ceramic while ours (wade, me) use alnico magnets, a5 i think. could you post a step by step account of exactly what you did? thanks.
wade truckerson
USAApr 24th, 2008 09:38 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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if you're asking me how to remove poles, it's beyond easy. you take the pickguard off, flip it over and unscrew the six 'hidden' poles that can only be adjusted from the underside of the pickup, there's 3 in each coil. you may want to put a cloth on your guitar to keep it from getting scratched.
you can take the pickup out if you want, but i left it in and held it with my left hand to keep it from moving. just turn the pole pieces counterclockwise until they come all the way out, making sure not to let any of the delicate pickup wires get in way.
when you're done take the opportunity to lower the overall pickup height using the four adjustment screws on the 'top' side of the pickguard, because while the guard is off you'll be able to easily see how low you can adjust the pup before it'll fall out. adjust each corner to be as low as it can while still remaining securely screwed in.
put the guard back, maybe with two or three screws to hold it on and test the guitar out to see how you like it. you should notice a general improvement in the sound already. raise the six remaining polepieces according to your preference for pickup height. not sure how high paulinpac set them, but i like pickups low so i only raised them a few complete turns.
you'll also have to raise or lower the poles individually to balance the sound out again; for instance, i found the G string to be too loud and the low E, A, and D strings to be too quiet. i adjusted the poles accordingly and the sound became well balanced fast.
it's more simple and straightforward than i'm making it sound, once you start it'll be over in 15 minutes and your guitar will sound much better for it.
MT Buckaroo
Contributing Member
*
Big Sky Country
Guitars, Cadillacs,...Apr 24th, 2008 10:20 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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Dang, timely thread to notice right now. I'm sitting here warming up the soldering iron with a couple of 500k pots about to go in my '72 Custom for the WR bucker, and lo and behold, here is some advice from Mr. Fralin as to a novel approach.
Kudos FDP!
wade truckerson
USAApr 24th, 2008 10:23 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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put the pots in anyway. at least for the neck pickup; the bridge may get too bright. i have 500k working hand in hand with this mod on my neck pickup and it sounds great
MT Buckaroo
Contributing Member
*
Big Sky Country
Guitars, Cadillacs,...Apr 24th, 2008 10:25 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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Yeah, the 500s were just for the neck pup. I guess a .022 716P Orange Drop will work fine.
Can't wait to get it all done.
MT Buckaroo
Contributing Member
*
Big Sky Country
Guitars, Cadillacs,...Apr 25th, 2008 02:30 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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PaulinPac and wade are spot on with this. I experienced the same results with my litle project as wade. Big improvement. Not a 57 PAF, but a big improvement.
You learn something new everyday here.
Aaron Williams
Madison, WI
I like music.Apr 25th, 2008 02:40 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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I'm gonna try this tomorrow.
MT Buckaroo-you say it doesn't sound like a 57 PAF?? I'm hoping this mod doesn't sound at all like a gibson humbucker, i'm hoping the mod just makes the Fender WRH breathe a bit, open up some of the muddiness and add some clarity. Other then that, I still want it to sound like a WRH! I'm just a bit worried about your comment, "Not a 57 PAF, but a big improvement." Any thoughts from the people that have done this mod?
thanks
MT Buckaroo
Contributing Member
*
Big Sky Country
Guitars, Cadillacs,...Apr 25th, 2008 04:09 PM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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No, no, not to worry. If anything, it sounds more like a regular chrome covered Tele neck pup. You gain a lot more top end and clarity than before, but it still has a round sound with soft edges. It's not a miracle, just an improvement.
I just meant by my comment that some people might expect the WRH to get you into Fat Tele territory ala a Keef mod, where a Gibson style PAF is put in the neck position. Just saying it is not that. If you want a Gibson style bucker, you'll have to put one in there (and drill a new hole for the center mounting screw), because the WRH ain't going to fill that bill. (Incidentally, I have tried that in the past with a Duncan Seth Lover in the neck and didn't love it. Never could get a vintage sounding bridge pup to match up.)
Do pay attention to the polepiece height as per wade's suggestion. When I first did this last night and plugged in, I thought, hmmm, low E, A, and D still sound muffled. Then I gave them a few more turns counterclockwise and it made a big difference. So this is a fairly height sensitive adjustment.
I don't know how much of a real difference you will hear with the old 250k pots still in. For that matter, I don't know how much of the difference I hear is due to the 500k pots, and how much to the pickup alteration. All I know is, it is better than it was. I can't always say that about my guitar mods. ;-)
Aaron Williams
Madison, WI
I like music.Apr 26th, 2008 02:13 AM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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Thanks! Great description of the sound. I think I understand now. I'm looking for some more clarity, in the quest for tone, inches matter. In all my searches for tone, small tweaks can make the difference. It's weird though, and this is a bit off topic..sorry. But I bought my CIJ 72 Thinline in 2000, didn't play it for four years, didn't have enough bite for me. I found that it is a 97' model. I have done absolutely no mods on it since I got it, after reading this thread and mod, I decide I should try it out as well as the 500K mod. Simple but sweet. I pull off the pickguard and low and behold it's got 500k pots in it? WHAT! Is anyone aware of CIJ having 500K pots in it or did the person I bought it from put 500K in it? The guy that owned it was not a player by any means? Just curious if anyone has seen a stock Thinline with 500K pots in it?
What i'm really hoping this mod does is add a little Fender punch and some clarity and definition in my low E and A strings. When i'm playing with the band, those two strings tend to get lost in the mix.
I will let you know if I hear a big difference since I've always played with a 500K pot. Thanks for the heads up on the pole piece height as well.
MT Buckaroo
Contributing Member
*
Big Sky Country
Guitars, Cadillacs,...Apr 26th, 2008 11:41 AM Edit Profile Print Topic Search
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See trustee's post above. Is you CIJ WRH ceramic? My guitar is a MIM, '02 manuf. I believe. So it has the alnico magnets I guess.
I always think of ceramic pups as bar magnets and alnico as rods, but maybe I'm off base there.
Anyway, you could always to to 1meg pots. What size cap is on those 500k's?
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